Living With Potentially Dangerous Venomous Spiders


It was the end of a near perfect day. I was working on a wildlife management plan for a large tract of mountainous timberland. Being so involved in my work, the day was ending, and the base camp was three miles away. Finding a suitable campsite and spending the night rather than running the risk of traveling after dark in thick timber and along high cliffs was a must.
I selected a rock shelter that gave me protection from the wind and would be dry in the event of rain. As it was getting dark, I cleaned out a spot, looking to be sure I wasn’t about to spend the night with a copperhead and brought in several armloads of leaves to put under the Mylar emergency sleeping bag I unfolded from my survival kit. After building a fire I ate a couple of strips of jerky and settled into the sleeping bag for a good night’s sleep.
During the night, I felt an insect crawling across my bare belly under my shirt. Without fully awakening, I mashed the critter, felt a slight stick like a brier, and went back to sleep. The next morning, I woke up to feeling somewhat ill and had a burning sensation on my abdomen. Getting out of the sleeping bag, I pulled up my shirt and as the semi-crushed body of a brown recluse spider fell in the dirt at my feet. I knew I was bitten and quickly looked just over my belly button to see the bite wound with a dark red ring around it.
The next few weeks were exciting as the bite quickly became ulcerated and I lost a large chunk of tissue resulting in a permanent scar just above my navel. I have been bitten once more since that adventure with a more severe reaction. I have one of those whose immune systems that is not tolerant of the brown recluse venom.
The brown recluse is just one of three dangerous venomous spiders found in the U.S. and southern Canada. The other two are the black widow and the hobo spider, which is still under study to see just how dangerous its bite may or may not be.
Many spiders common in the U.S. and Canada are somewhat venomous. Due to their small size, short fangs or small mouth, they do not bite us at all when we encounter them. If they do, it is not life threatening or very painful. For this article, we will discuss the three whose bites could be dangerous.
If you live, work, or play where these three spiders are found, chances are good you are in close contact with them daily and don’t even know it. For example, a rural home in Kansas was studied by entomologist. During a six-month period, 2,055 brown recluse spiders were either collected or killed. No one in the family that lived in the home had ever been bitten.
Rural homesteads are havens for venomous spiders due to the natural supply of insects they depend upon and to the vast number of places to live out of sight of man.
Fortunately, the three spiders discussed here are considered non-aggressive and stay hidden most of the time. Most bites occur because the spider is trapped or unintentionally handled. On the plus side, it is estimated by entomologists that at least 15% of the bites from these spiders are “dry bites,” that is, no venom is injected.
While everyone’s immune system reacts differently to a spider bite, symptoms can range anywhere from slight sting to death.


Brown recluse


The range of the brown recluse is said to be from Nebraska to Ohio and across the south from Texas to Florida, but these spiders have been confirmed in other states due to people moving household goods and supplies that contain spiders. These spiders establish new isolated populations.
The brown recluse is a medium-sized spider with leg span from 0.8 to 1.6 -inches and a color range from yellow tan to dark brown. The most distinguishing characteristics – six eyes (most spiders have eight eyes) arranged a semicircle of three pairs on top of the head, and a violin-shaped marking extending from the area of the eyes to the abdomen.
Egg-laying primarily occurs from May through July. The female lays about 50 eggs that are encased in an off-white silken sac that is about 2/3-inch diameter. Each female may produce several egg sacs over a period of several months. Tiny spiders emerge from the egg sac in about a month or less. Their development is slow. It takes an average of one year to reach the adult stage from time of egg deposit. Adult brown recluse spiders often live about one to two years. They can survive 6 months without food or water.
The brown recluse spider spins a loose, irregular web of very sticky, off-white to grayish threads. This web serves as the spider’s daytime retreat, and it often is constructed in an undisturbed corner. This spider roams at night searching for insect prey. Recent research indicates that the brown recluse spider is largely a scavenger, preferring dead insects. Mature males travel at night in search of females.
Brown recluse spiders may be found indoors or outdoors. In favorable habitats, their numbers are usually high. They often thrive in older buildings, woodsheds, logs, stacks of lumber, rock piles, outbuildings, storage boxes, unused shoes, stored clothing and behind furniture.
The brown recluse spider normally bites only when crushed, handled or disturbed. Some people have been bitten in bed after rolling over onto the spider. Others have been bitten after accidentally touching the spider when moving boxes in their garage. Some bites occur when people put on little used clothing or shoes inhabited by a brown recluse.



The bite of this spider can result in a painful, deep wound that takes months to heal. Death from a bite is rare, but bites are most dangerous to young children, the elderly, and those in poor physical condition. If there is a severe reaction to the bite, the bite site can erupt into a deep lesion. The wound may range from the size of a dime to the size of a softball. The dead tissue peels away, exposing underlying tissues. The sunken, ulcerating sore may heal slowly taking up to two months. Full recovery may take several months, and scarring may be a reminder.


Black widow


The black widow is found throughout North America except in northern Canada and in Alaska. Most reported human fatalities have occurred in the southeastern states. In 1954, an antivenom was approved for use on black widow bites. It has been estimated that prior to the availability of the antivenom approximately 5 % of the black widow bites were serious to fatal. An old rural doctor who made many homestead house calls prior to 1960 once told me in an interview that many of his calls were to farms which used the old fashion outhouse. He said that the black widow spider found an easy place to catch flies – it was to build a web just under the outhouse seat. Men using the outhouse were often bitten on the genitals.
The venomous female black widow has a shiny black body, approximately 0.6- inch long, and usually a red hourglass-shaped mark on the underside of her globular abdomen. On some, the hourglass marking is replaced with several triangles or spots or an irregular longitudinal blotch. I have seen some that the red was barely visible. She has slim black legs with a span of 1.5- inches. The less venomous male is smaller than the female and usually is a patterned brown color.
The female lays several batches of eggs, containing up to 750 eggs each, in one summer. The egg case, about .5- inch in diameter, is suspended in the web. It is white to sand in color and has a paper-like texture. There may be four to nine egg sacs produced during a summer. Young black widows are colored orange and white when they emerge 1 to 4 weeks later. Normally, only one to twelve young survive after the egg incubation period of 14 to 30 days, due to cannibalism by their hungry siblings.
The black widow spider may be found under stones, loose bark, in water meters, under outhouse seats, near water faucets, in woodpiles, vacant wildlife burrows, garages, storage buildings, well houses, root cellars, and barns. I have seen them nest in sagebrush in New Mexico, under a children’s plastic wading pool in New York and in a hollow opening in a tree in Louisiana.
As stated above, the black widow spider is not aggressive. Years ago, one of my sons, then 5 years old, brought me the largest black widow I have ever seen. He was holding it by one leg of the big spider and calling it a “baby octopus”. To my pleasant surprise the spider made no attempt to bite him.
Because its venom is reported to be 15 times stronger than a rattlesnake’s, the black widow is feared by many. However, even when it bites, it injects a small amount of its potent venom, sometimes none. The bite can produce nausea, muscle aches and a paralysis of the diaphragm that can make breathing difficult.


Hobo Spider

A relatively newcomer to the biting spiders of North America is the hobo spider. It is questionable as to how venomous this spider really is. It is found in southern British Columbia, Washington, Oregon, Idaho, western Montana, western Wyoming and northern Utah, probably soon in northern California. It was introduced accidentally into the U.S. in the early 1900’s from Europe.
The hobo spider has a brown front body region where the legs are attached and brown legs. The abdomen has a distinctive pattern of yellow markings on a grey background, although this pattern can be difficult to discern without the aid of a microscope or hand lens. Unlike many other similar-looking spiders, hobo spiders do not have dark bands on their legs. Spiders with such banding are not hobo spiders.
Mature female hobo spiders are 3/8-5/8- inches long, and male hobo spiders are 9/32-9/16- inches in body length. Males have enlarged pedipalps located near the mouth, resembling short legs.
According to the Utah State University Extension Service, “hobo spider eggs deposited in the fall begin hatching in the spring. The spiderlings will molt (shed their skin) once before breaking free from the egg sac around early June. The juvenile hobo spiders grow and develop over the summer (or several summers) and will overwinter again before reaching maturity the following year. Males and females will mature from June to September. Males seek out females for mating during the summer and most die before October. Mated females start laying eggs in mid-September, with one to four egg sacs produced over a period of four weeks. Fewer eggs are produced if food is limited or if temperatures are cooler than normal. Cold temperatures eventually terminate the production of eggs by the females. Most females will die in late autumn, but some may overwinter and live into the following summer.”
Hobo spiders’ frequent areas such as log or timber piles, rock piles, holes in logs/trees, or where tall grass meets crevices in soil where they can make their characteristic funnel webs. The webs are funnel shaped, narrow at the bottom, wide at the top. The spider waits in the small hole at the bottom of the funnel for prey to contact the web. When it senses a vibration, it will emerge from the hole to bite its prey.
The hobo spider, which has difficulty climbing, has a reputation of being an aggressive spider but experts tell me that the spider is near blind and often when frightened it will run towards the person because it can’t see very good, giving the impression that it is aggressive. The hobo, like the two dangerous spiders mentioned above, tends to avoid humans.
Just how venomous a bite from a hobo spider can be is still under study. In fact, where they are found in Europe are not listed as dangerous. It is recorded that a bite from a hobo spider can be painful. Usually, bites occur when it is in clothing or other areas where the skin of a person is pushing up against it. There are still many studies in place to determine the potency of these spiders. However, there is lots of conflicting information.
Protect your homestead from dangerous spiders


Here are some tips from the experts as to how to protect your homestead from spiders:


• Use tight-fitting screens on windows and doors. Seal small cracks and openings to your house using caulk or other sealants. Check under outside doors for a tight fit.
• Vacuum regularly, especially around door and window frames, behind furniture, and along ceiling and floor edges. Vacuum up any spiders that make it inside and dispose of them outside in a sealed bag.
• Clear away clutter, such as old furniture, boxes, or clothes that sit in undisturbed areas of your home, shop or garage.
• Keep spiders from crawling into bed with you by moving beds away from walls, and removing dust ruffles that reach the floor, and items stored under the bed.
• Inspect firewood, potted plants, and other objects before bringing them inside.
• Keep wood piles, rock piles, shrubbery, and other objects away from the outer walls of your home.
• Remove spiders and their webs from the foundation, eaves, windows, and door frames around your home.
• Wear a long-sleeved shirt and pants, hat, gloves, and shoes when handling stored firewood or boxes, and when cleaning out sheds, garages, barns, basements, attics, and crawl spaces.
• Shake out and check clothing and shoes for spiders before putting them on – especially if the clothes are stored or hung in the garage, shed, or barn. I once got my fishing waders from my garage to find a black widow had taken up residence in them. Store apparel and outdoor equipment in tightly closed plastic bags.
• If a spider gets on you, brush it off. Don’t mash it. Many bites occur when a spider is pressed up against our skin.
• Controlling spiders is not easy. Chemical insecticides are not very effective against spiders, nor do the spiders readily pick up sprays or powders. So just spraying is not a great defense against spiders. With their long legs, spiders keep their abdomen well above the ground, so sprayed insecticide residue on a surface will only touch their feet. But they don’t have a circulatory system that will carry the insecticide from the bottoms of their feet to the organs in their bodies that would cause them to die. Spider control needs to be a compound that comes in contact with the spider body.
• Get rid of other bugs. Cut out the spider’s food supply.
If bitten by a spider

If you’re bitten by a venomous spider, you may notice any, or almost none, of the following as spider bites effect different people differently:


• Intense pain at the site of the wound
• Stiffness or joint pain
• Muscle spasms
• Abdominal pain, nausea or vomiting
• Fever or chills
• Difficulty breathing or swallowing
• A wound that spreads or turns into a sore, an ulcerating sore if a brown recluse bite.
• Dizziness
• Difficulty speaking
• Convulsions

Treatment of venomous spider bites:


• Call your doctor or Poison Control Center for instructions
• Wash the bite area with soap and water.
• Elevate the area to prevent spread of the venom.
• If possible, catch the spider and place in a small bottle of rubbing alcohol for identification by medical personnel.
• Always seek immediate emergency medical care. An anti-venom medication is sometimes given for black widow spider bites. An antivenom has not been approved for use on brown recluse victims at this writing. In extreme cases hospitalization is required after black widow, brown recluse.
• Keep your tetanus boosters up to date, every 10 years. Spider bites can become infected with tetanus spores.
Bites from some other spiders can be painful and can lead to infections, but they do not pose the hazard of toxins associated with the brown recluse, black widow or possibly the hobo spiders. Most of us live with venomous spiders whether we know it or not. The good thing is these spiders want to avoid us as much as we do them. That is the reason, on average, only 6 people, usually infants or elderly die from a venomous spider bite annually in the U.S.

Green River Knife – The Knife of the Fur Trade Era – NOT!


“Up to the Green River” is a saying attributed to the mountainmen of the fur trade era. It has been recorded that this saying had nothing to do with the Green River near which several rendezvous were held and a landmark in many mountainman stories. Instead, it is said that it meant the very best of a product or skill and referred to the high-quality J. Russell & Co. Green River Works knife. Others said the saying came from plunging a knife into an opponent up to the part of the knife blade where the J. Russell & Co. Green River Works logo was etched. Either way, the sayings have been used to imply that the Green River knife was a major item that most mountainmen obtained, or wanted, when they went west to trap beavers.


When I became interested in all things mountainman one of the first things I read, and was told by “experts”, was that the J. Russell & Co. Green River Works knife was the knife all mountain men carried, period. In fact, many went on to tell me that it was also used by many longhunters in the late 1700’s. Armed with this information I set about ordering me a J. Russell & Co. Green River Works knife kit and put together a knife and sheath to go with my mountain man outfit. I was ready for re-enactment of the 1825 – 1840 fur trade era.


It wasn’t until I became a member of the American Mountainmen and attended my first rendezvous that a wooly-looking old man in buckskins took me to task about my knife. The knowledgeable old gentleman sat me down in front of a campfire and told me the error of my thinking on the J. Russell & Co. Green River Works knife. To me, it was a wake-up call on mountainman cutlery and set me on a journey of discovery.


J. Russell & Co. Green River Works


To understand the role the Russell Green River knife played, or didn’t play, during the mountainman era of 1825 – 1840, one must first know something about John Russell and his business history. Russell was born in Greenfield, Massachusetts in 1797 and was an apprentice to his father, a goldsmith. At the age of 21 Russell left New England and went to Georgia to try his hand at business. There, after a few years, he became wealthy in the cotton business and had a desire to return home to his birthplace. He wanted to explore his dream of creating “Made in the USA” metal tool products. Sheffield, England, had enjoyed a monopoly in the U.S. for many years importing metal tools, especially hunting knives.


In 1832 Russell built a steam operated factory to manufacture chisels and axe heads made from the best of English steel, the type normally reserved for tableware. He wanted quality products. By 1834 he felt he had the experience and machinery to begin making quality knives. The English had been flooding the U.S. market with hunting knives and Russell believed he could make a knife just as good as the English, make them faster using the latest industrial technology and compete in the growing cutlery business.


Knives in England were made in steps by a cottage industry on contract with exporting companies. One home shop would make the blanks, after inspection by the company, the blanks would go to another small shop where grinding would take place. After that the knives would go to another shop where the handles would be attached. Often, they were shipped without an edge. Russell wanted to do all those steps at one factory where he controlled the quality and make the knives much faster.
Russell was off to a good start making quality, but simple, butcher/hunting knives when in 1836 his factory burned to the ground. As he raised money to rebuild, he realized that the best power source to run a factory was waterpower, so the new knife factory was located on the Green River in Greenfield, Massachusetts. The new factory was christened the Green River Works and the knives produced in the facility were stamped “J. Russell & Co. Green River Works”, thus the birth of the Green River knife.


Using waterpower, the factory was able to utilize new manufacturing equipment such as trip hammers, stamping and trimming dies, multiple grindstones and emery wheels. It was quality mass production using the best English steel available. Russell offered English knife craftsmen higher wages and attracted talented knife makers to the new factory. By 1837 he was making high quality butcher/hunting knives and selling them at prices below the English knives.


Green River Knives Arrive in the Mountains


It is not known when the first J. Russell & Co. Green River Works hunting knives first arrived as a trade good at a Rocky Mountains rendezvous, but the best guess would be in 1838 or 1839. Many scholars of the fur trade era think that it might have been 1840 before the J. Russell & Co. Green River Works knives arrived in the Rocky Mountains. The last rendezvous was held in 1840. The heavily trapped beaver populations were low and the demand for beaver fur for making top hats had gone over to silk. The fur trade era was coming to an end and the Green River knife, a late arrival, had missed most of it.


However, the mountainmen didn’t just suddenly disappear. There was a booming new hide business, buffalo skins, and many mountain men became buffalo hunters. Others became wagon train scouts, gold miners, Army scouts, hunting guides and homesteaders. Their need for quality knives continued and the J. Russell & Co. Green River Works developed a curved skinning knife and a slightly larger hunting knife named Dadley, a name given to the design by the English craftsman working for J. Russell & Company, to sell in addition to the original hunting knife. All three were called Green River Knives.

 

 

 

 


It is interesting to note that the excellent reputation of the Green River Works knives and sales of the knives were so brisk that several of the English knife makers started stamping Green River on their knives and copying the Russell designs.


Matching Dates


It is easy to compare the dates of the J. Russell & Co. Green River Works history and the dates of the fur trade era and see why the Green River knife was not in use or sold at the rendezvous between 1826 and about1838. Green River knives weren’t even thought about during most of that time. However, from about 1840 until the late 1800’s the Green River knives made their mark on western expansion and were a favorite tool of mountainmen, Native Americans, buffalo hunters, settlers, explorers and adventurers in general. Many saw service during the War Between the States.


Prior to the Russell Green River knives, the longhunters, mountainmen and early explorers depended upon a wide variety of knife suppliers and knife designs. England and France supplied many of the early knives that were available commercially. The blade designs were mostly a butcher-type, with some being a dagger design. Some were small and some large. Many of the knives used prior to Russell & Co. were made by local blacksmiths from files and rasps. Overall the butcher blade design seemed to be the most popular blade during that period.


So as the old mountainman told me at the campfire many years ago, “its O.K. to have a Green River knife in your belt as it was a favorite knife in the mountains after it became available, but just don’t go telling everyone it was the favorite knife of mountainmen throughout the fur trade era. It wern’t round then”

The Last Mountain Man

This coming Monday, April 4th, we celebrate my late dad’s 118th birthday. George N. Fears, who passed away at the age of 94, was a great dad, husband, grandfather and Christian man. He was a woodsman’s woodsman. Here is part of an interview that writer Denise Huddleston wrote about him in 1976.

“My family was living in the hills of Lincoln County Tennessee in 1904 trying to keep a-living raising crops–especially corn when the news came of the “King Cotton” crop being grown in Alabama. My daddy packed us all in a two horse covered wagon in 1906 and we made the grueling journey to Alabama settling in a three room cabin on Hurricane Creek at the base of Tater Knob Mountain. Things were a bit better for us here, yet we still had little to show for our everyday struggles. Often, I hoed crops, trapped, picked cotton, and did the chores needing to be done around the homestead until I reached the age of ten. By then both my parents had died, I started gathering ginseng, which is a root to be found on the side of the mountain. We got pert near $7 a pound for the ginseng which back then was a lot of money”, laughs the elderly Fears which to the age of 74 has managed to keep a sparkle of the excitement of life in his aging eyes.


With a look of nostalgia Mr. Fears continues saying, “I kept on hunting the wild ginseng up to when I was a young man. “At that time, men were fixing up remote ginseng camps in the mountains which grew strictly oriental roots. The plants were laid up like onion beds. I worked in a camp just under the north end of Tater Knob Mountain as the camp hunter to provide meat for our camp meals. Also, I pulled grass and weeds from around the ginseng beds, watered them and finally harvested them. We didn’t have vats to wash them in like they do today so we just cut down a tree, carved out a basin and let that be our washtub. Ground squirrels and moles became my worst enemies for they’d make quick ruin of the entire crop if they were allowed to! Yep, ginseng helped me out a good deal then and whenever I get a chance, I still like to hunt for it.”

Showing me a fine display of ginseng in his backyard, George Fears reflects back even further, “The greater part of my living between 1914 and 1940 was made by digging sang, trapping and selling furs. I had to quit school at the end of the 8th grade to help provide for younger siblings. A man back then had to live the way he knew best and those were the only things I knew how to do then. Warm summers and extremely cold winters, I’d’ be out running traps knowing that if there wasn’t a possum or coon caught in a trap there’d be no food for that day. It was a rough living and sometimes lonely, yet I sure couldn’t take a wife and expect to support her and myself both when I could barely support me most of the time. For several years, I’d be living out on the mountain alone in a tent coming in only to sell my furs and buy flour, beans and coffee, the barest essentials. I’m a good bit older now, but if I lived farther out from the city, I’d be back out on Tater Knob Mountain running traps just like before”

He continued, “Coming in from the mountains, I found myself a job in a little country store. I tended to customers and help load supplies that were to last for the next week. Most of the business was done on weekends and even then not many folks came in for the Depression was upon us all. Flour, meal, coffee and salt were the main items to be sold for people who had to raise most of their own food because they didn’t have enough money to buy it. Matter of fact, folks used to live off $5.00 worth of groceries a week. So, when I wasn’t helping in the store, I’d be out on my horse with a pack mule traveling back up into the remote coves and hollows buying hide’s, sang roots and fur from mountain folk.

In 1936 Fears, still working in the store and bartering for furs, applied to the TVA for a job which was two years in its’ coming.

“After coming off that mountain” Fears grins impishly, “I saw what I thought was the prettiest sight I’d ever seen in my life–a beautiful, young schoolteacher who I soon took to be my bride. We raised up two fine boys and I taught them the ways of the woods just as I was taught. Even today when they come visiting me, we haul off into the woods recapturing an era a long time gone”



Today, some 72 years since coming to Alabama, Mr. Fears is retired, living in a nice home raising his own ginseng, and occasionally setting his traps in the mountains. Some people may pass him by discounting him, “just an old man”, yet in his heart and soul he remembers the role he played in settling Alabama.


 

Happy Birthday, Dad. I love you… JW

My Dream Knife


The tall lanky young man that sat in my living room was about to leave, after a pleasant visit, when he reached into his coat pocket and pulled out one of the best surprises of my life. In his deep unassuming voice he stated, as he handed a knife in a brown sheath to me, “I know we just never got the knife you really wanted, but I think you will like this one.” Pulling the knife from its sheath I was shocked, it really was the knife I have wanted for many years!

I have written many times that the knife I chose to use during my long career as a wildlife manager, hunting outfitter & guide, and outdoor writer was the USA made Schrade Old Timer model 125 OT, a large folding, lock-blade knife who’s USA made version long ago faded from outdoor gear catalogs. For over five decades I have depended upon that knife for most of my guiding and outdoor writing adventures.



My first 125OT was given to me in about 1970 by Henry Baer of the Schrade Walden Cutlery Co. with the challenge to try it as my knife while guiding big game hunters. He felt sure I would like it. I gave the knife a lot of hard use and it became my knife of choice. Made from 1095 high carbon steel, the 4 ½ -inch clip point blade held an edge well and was quick and easy to sharpen in the field. The contoured 5-inch handle fit my hand nicely. That knife saw much of the outdoor world with me, and it is still in good shape.

For many years I wished for a fixed blade belt knife design that had all the qualities of the 125OT but could never find one. Then I met Lucas Bullington (shown with me in the photo at the top of the page) of Lucas Forge (customhuntingknives.org), a master bladesmith who custom makes many high quality knifes including one called the Frontier Clip Point that was very similar to the knife of my dreams. I purchased a 3 ½-inch Frontier and liked it so much I later had Lucas make me one with a slightly larger 4 ½-inch handle with a 4-inch blade. It is really a good general purpose camp knife but still not quite the fixed-blade custom knife based on the 125OT I had wished for, that was until the surprise visit from Lucas.



Lucas and I decided to name the new knife “Old Guide” as I am an old guide and the idea for the design came from the Henry Baer’s Old Timer brand of knives. Since Lucas turned the Old Guide over to me, I have used it for farm chores, on turkey hunts, trout fishing trips and for camp chores. It rides well in the custom leather sheath, made by Lucas brother Ike Bullington, a master leather craftsman. I have cut hay bailing cord, sliced tomatoes, cleaned wild turkey, smeared mayonnaise on bread, cleaned fish and cut kindling with the Old Guide and I can say this is the knife I always wanted. The flat grind blade is hand forged from O-1 high carbon steel with a Lucas Forge aged finish. It holds an edge for long periods of use and can be sharpened quickly and easily in the field. The handsome handle is made from fancy curly maple with brass pins and a brass lanyard hole liner. Lucas contoured the handle, like the 125OT, to fit the users hand to minimize slippage.



I knew the Old Guide was a winner when after seeing it master woodsman Medrick Northrop contacted Lucas to see about having another made.  I don’t know how many moons I have left of living on the trail, but this will be my knife until that time comes, then one of my sons can slide it onto his belt. Thank you, Lucas, for my dream knife.